Episode 70 with Tony Simon

Welcome to episode 70. Instructor Tony Simon joins us this week with three new self-defense stories. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you react in their situation? (15:30 )

Rob- Introduction- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 70 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This podcast is for people who think they might want a firearm.. and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Tony Simon.

Hi, Tony.  How have you been?  I heard you on Lock and Load Radio.

Tony- Hi, Rob.  I’ve been busy getting the word out about our tee shirts that we are selling to raise funds for The 2nd is For Everyone: Diversity Shoots, getting classes ready for students and writing a new curriculum for a Home Hardening class that I am going to teach.

Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to use your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Tony- Our first story took place last week in Memphis, Tennessee.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed at work in the afternoon?

You work in a convenience store.  A man comes in, grabs two beers, and heads to the door.  You shout for him to come to the counter and pay.  He shouts back that you can’t stop him.  He reaches for his waistband and tells you to stay where your are.  You think he has a gun.  He starts to turn toward you.  You draw and fire your sidearm.  The robber runs, but collapses outside.  You call police.  You know the drill.  The store has been robbed before.

Tony- This bad guy pretended that he had a gun to intimidate the victim. As Mas Ayoob says the attacker suffered a failure in his victim selection process. He got shot by an armed “victim”.

Tony- We here at the podcast always say that you need a plan when it comes to armed self defense. Once the bad guy has stated he intends to use deadly force, acts like he has a means to carry out that intent and advances on you as if he is going to harm you then you must use that plan without hesitation.

You must go with 100% effort to save your life. If he ends up not having a gun, like this thief, that is his fault that he got shot.The time it takes you to figure out if he was “serious” could cost you your life.

Tony- Like our first story, our second story also happened in Memphis, Tennessee

Rob- Second Story- Are you armed at home late at night?

You worked late and then ran some errands on the way home.  You live in a gated apartment complex.  You let yourself through the gate and drive to your parking place.  You get out of your car and grab your bags.  A man comes running at you out of the darkness.  He grabs your computer bag and your purse.  The strap is over your shoulder.  You hang on and scream for your boyfriend.  He comes running out of your apartment and tackles your attacker.  Your Ruger pistol falls out of your purse.  Now the three of you are scrambling to grab it.  You win, and shoot your attacker twice in the chest.  You and your boyfriend stand up and reach for your phones.

The police charged your attacker with aggravated assault and criminal attempted felony.  You go to the hospital for scrapes and cuts.

Tony- Security is a feeling, you must be aware of what is happening around you. Gated communities are not safe.  They may be less dangerous than a convenience store parking lot at 1 am but they are not safe.

On body carry is much better than carrying your firearm in your bag or purse. Your bag is the most likely target of the thief. When he grabs you by your bag he has all of the leverage and you end up holding onto the strap and getting dragged along for the ride.

Tony- I’ve followed people into secured office buildings and have had them hold the door open for me and give me directions to offices inside the building. Never assume you are completely safe because getting into your building requires a key fob.

Tony- Our third story happened last week in Lumberton, North Carolina.

Give Lloyd a listen at http://www.armedlutheran.us/

Rob- Third story- Are you armed at work very early in the morning?  

You’re working very late.  The front of your store is closed, and you’re sitting in the back of your store repairing your customer’s cell phones.  You hear a loud crash and the entire building shakes.  Five young men smashed their way into your store through the front windows and doors.  You grab your shotgun and walk out of the back of the store.  The robbers turn and run..except for one of them.  He keeps coming toward you.  You press the trigger and the thug drops to the ground.

You call police.  Unfortunately, the police take your shotgun as evidence.  Fortunately, you have another one.

Tony-  The victim was a 66 year old man and the attacker was a teen that had multiple partners breaking into his business.

Rob- Disparity of force.

Tony- Fighting off multiple attackers, alone, at night, isn’t something that comes easily. Especially if those attackers are determined to hurt you. Being able to operate your gun, move, hit multiple moving targets and keeping your gun loaded and in the fight isn’t something that you “figure out” during a fight. Taking defensive firearms training teaches you what you don’t know about armed self defense, your self, your firearm and your self-defense plan.

Rob- This man saved his own life, but his attackers could have overwhelmed him.

Tony- This was multiple people breaking in and attempting to steal as much as they can carry. If it came to a fight they were not going to “fight fair”. Criminals aren’t stupid.  They don’t want a fair fight. Neither should you, take the time to train to be a winner during a life or death confrontation.

Rob- So where do we learn?

Tony- Most ranges won’t allow you shoot at multiple targets, they won’t allow you to rapid fire, they won’t allow you to turn off the lights and they won’t allow you to move while you shoot. Going to a class on a range that is set up for this type of training is what we need to look for and where we learn these skills.

Rob- that sounds important.

Tony- It is, but first you have to know how to operate your firearm. One of the problems that I see most often in class and at the range is that some people don’t know how their gun operates on a instinctive level. You need to have intimate knowledge of the operation of your self defense firearm, that means taking it to the range and using it at least monthly not sitting it in the corner and letting it collect dust until you need it. One of my suggestions on how to get good operating your firearm is to take up a shooting sport ,at  a local range, using your self defense gun or the same type of gun as your self-defense gun. Shooting in a weekly event is fun. You will meet new people and learn to shoot under the stress of competition. Adding the stress in a non life threatening way allows you to see how you operate and learn what you need to work on.

Rob- The victim probably didn’t see the muzzle of his gun as he aimed it.

Tony- The victim most likely was looking at the threat not the front sight.  Once you have those basic skills at the unconscious level you will be better equipped to defend yourself.

Exit-  Rob- That wraps up this episode. Tony, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

Tony- Our listeners can find me at Simon Says Train on Facebook and also at SimonSaysTrain Instagram and the 2nd is For Everyone on Facebook. For a limited time we are selling a tee shirt to raise funds for our 2nd Amendment workshop, The 2nd is For Everyone: Diversity Shoot, on our website DiversityShoot.com stop by to see what we are about, make a donation or buy a shirt.

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

Tony-   If you liked this show, then you’ll like the other podcasts on the Self-defense radio network.  We share this podcast with you for free, and ask that you share it with a friend.  Please give us a rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

Please support the Crime Prevention Research Center at
http://crimeresearch.org/

Episode 69 with Amanda Suffecool

Welcome to episode 69. Instructor Amanda Suffecool joins us this week with three new self-defense stories. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you react in their situation? (18 minutes )

Rob- Introduction- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 69 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This podcast is for people who think they might want a firearm.. and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Amanda Suffecool.

Hi, Amanda.  How have you been?

Amanda- Hi, Rob.  This is my first visit to Self-Defense Gun Stories.

Rob- Jenna Meek stepped away from the show.  I appreciate her giving us so much attention for as long as she did.  I’m glad you can join us.

Amanda- firearms instructor, eye on the target, realize FAC, NRA fashion show.  Fashion show manual.  Viceland video of the fashion show.

Amanda- Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to use your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Amanda- Our first story took place last week in Bloomfield, Kentucky.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed at home?  

You’re asleep in your bed.  Your dog starts barking in the middle of the night.  Moments later, your wife is screaming.  You get up, grab your gun, and follow the dog to your daughter’s room.  Your daughter is at a sleepover, but you open the door anyway.  There, you find a 19 year old boy standing in her room.  He raises his hands and surrenders.  The window is open where the intruder broke in.  Your wife calls police.  You hold the intruder at gunpoint.

Amanda- Good job for not shooting.  Finger off the trigger.  

Rob- The news report said it took 20 minutes for the police to arrive.

Amanda-  Flashlight.    Lighting of   some sort.

Rob- Do you train your students to hold someone at gunpoint?

Amanda- Our second story happened last week in Brooklyn, New York.

Rob- Second story- Are you armed at work in the middle of the day?

You work at a gun store.  Another customer walks in the shop at about 11 in the morning.  He asks to see a gun.  You look down and open the display case.  That is when he sprays you in the face with pepper spray.  You step back.  The robber smashed the case top and grabs two guns.  You draw your gun and shoot him.  He runs.

Police find the two stolen guns on the floor..along with a trail of blood.

Amanda- Not sure of the laws in New York, but this is an interesting one.  Using your gun to defend property?  Do you know what the rules are for gun shop owners?

 

Amanda- Our third story happened last week in Tarpon springs, Florida.

Please support Buckeye Firearms Foundation at https://www.buckeyefirearmsfoundation.org/

Rob-  Third Story-  Are you armed at home during the night?

You hear shouts from an apartment next door.  Then you hear screams.  You grab your gun and look through the peep hole.  Your neighbor, Susan Bass, is screaming at a man to get out of her apartment, and the man is dressed in his underwear and attacking her.  You open the door and tell the man to stop.  He lunges at you.  You shoot him once in the leg.  That doesn’t stop him. You retreat to your apartment and he follows you.  You grab your 3 year old and retreat to the bathroom.  The intruder pushes the door open and you fight him off.

Police arrive and taze the attacker.  That doesn’t stop.  They wrestle him to the ground and handcuff him.  You, your neighbor, your daugher, and the drugged up intruder are taken to the hospital.

Amanda- Scary –  I am not sure, If I were the one in this situation that i would not have shot a second or a third time.    When he charges into my apartment and when he charges the bathroom door.

 

Exit-  Rob- That wraps up this episode. Amanda, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

 

Amanda- Our listeners can find me at eye on the target radio radio.

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

Amanda-  We share this podcast with you for free, and ask that you share it with a friend.  Please give us a rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

Learn more at SAF Training Division.

Episode 68 with Ben Branam

Welcome to episode 68. Instructor Ben Branam joins us this week with three new self-defense stories. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you do in their situation? (16 minutes )

Rob- Introduction- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 68 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This podcast is for people who think they might want a firearm.. and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Ben Branam.

Hi, Ben.  I know you’ve been instructing in Illinois.

Ben- Hi, Rob.  I got to teach in Illinois with Bob Mayne.

Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to use your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Ben- Our first story took place last week near Mobile, Alabama.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed at home in the early afternoon? (and here)

You hear a knock at your front door.  You look through the glass side panels and see three people standing outside.  They see you too.  They shoot you with a shotgun.  You step back and reach behind a cabinet.  You grab the handgun you keep there.  You open the door and shoot your attackers striking all three of them as they try to shoot you again.  You’ve met them before.

You’re a veteran of the marine corps.  Some young kids broke into your house last month.  You caught them.  They threatened you if you reported them to the police.  Now they are lying wounded outside your door.  You call police and ask for medical assistance.

Ben- Our second story happened last week in Salt Lake City.

Rob- Second Story-  Are you armed at work in the evening?

You work in a sandwich shop.  It is about 6pm when two man and a woman walk into the store.  One locks the front door, and the others pull out guns.  You see this from the back storage area and you push the door shut to keep them out. The female robber throws her body against the door to get to you.  The door opens a few inches.  You grab your firearm and shoot your attacker around the door.  The other robbers run. You and your co-worker call the police and medical personnel.  Neither of you are hurt.

 

Ben- Our third story happened last week in Las Vegas

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Rob- Third story- Are you armed when you’re at work?  

You run your own store selling phones and accessories.  It is almost closing time and a strange man walks in.  You’ve seen him on the streets before.  The stranger doesn’t look up, but walks up to the counter and kicks in the glass on the display case.  You walk to the cash register and grab your gun.  The robber looks up and then turns away.  He walks out of your store with his hands in the air.  You don’t shoot.

You took a class last week.  You never had your finger on the trigger because the robber had not threatened your life.

 

Exit- Rob- That wraps up this episode. Ben, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

Ben- Our listeners can find me at Modern Self Protection.com.  I live in San Antonio, and most of my classes are in central Texas.  Listeners can see my complete class schedule at my website, and they can also listen to my podcast.

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

Ben-  If you liked this show, please share it with a friend, and give us a rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

 

Listen to Gun Freedom Radio at http://gunfreedomradio.com

Episode 67 with Elizabeth Hautman

Welcome to episode 67 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. Self-defense instructor Elizabeth Hautman joins us this week. We report and analyze examples of armed civilian defense. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you do in their situation? (17 minutes )

Rob- Introduction- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 67 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This podcast is for people who think they might want a firearm.. and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Elizabeth Hautman.  Hello, again, Elizabeth.  I know you’ve been busy.

 

Elizabeth- Lots of teaching..and constitution camp.  Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports to exercise your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Rob- One of our listeners sent us a message.  Clayton said, “I think you should consider doing a long episode, maybe 1 out of every 4 or so. You could be more casual and have more conversation with the guest instructor. As a listener, I would love that.”

Rob- Clayton, I’ll ask the instructors.  Some would like it, and some are busy already and I’m lucky to get each minute with them.

Elizabeth- Our first story took place last week in Jacksonville, Florida.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed at home early in the morning?

You’re asleep in your apartment.  Your first sign of trouble is a crash of breaking glass.  Someone is breaking through the window at the back of your apartment..at 6 in the morning.  You keep your gun nearby because you were worried about a break in.  You grab your gun.  You see a man standing in your living room.  He sees you and moves toward you.  You fire three times and the man backs up toward the window.  You back up toward your room.  You grab your phone and call police.

You know your attacker.  He is your ex-boyfriend.  Last year he beat you and strangled you until you passed out.  You bought a gun..and learned how to use it.  You also moved to a new address, but tonight he found you.

Elizabeth- This victim was at a far higher risk than most people.  She recognized that fact and acted, so good for her.  She moved to a new address.  She might have changed jobs.  She also got a gun and learned how to use it.  She had her gun available when she needed it.  That saved her life.

Rob-  I’ve heard that you’re more likely to be involved in a gunfight if you have a gun at home.

Elizabeth- That phrase is designed to scare little old ladies who live in safe situations in the suburbs so they won’t buy a gun.  It isn’t the gun that causes the problems; its us.  We’re not all the same.  Poor people in our inner cities are more likely to be victims than rich people in gated communities.  A victim of domestic violence faces higher risks.  Of course these people are more likely to be attacked.  They choose to have guns in their home because they need one to defend themselves.

Rob- What else did you notice in this story.

Elizabeth-  A reporter wouldn’t mention it, but the victim needs a flashlight.

Rob-  A flashlight?

Elizabeth- You need to see what is going on.  Was this a drunk neighbor that was confused and broke into your house..or was it a serial abuser?  You need to know.  You also have to know how to call the police, but we’ll talk about that in our next story.

Rob- How can we get a gun quickly, but still have it secured when we’re asleep?

Elizabeth- She needed the gun in a hurry.

Lock your doors. She could have had an alarm. Quick access safe. But most of all, she had a plan of action.

Rob- Are you ready to move on?

Elizabeth- Our second story happened last week in Spring, Texas.

Rob- Second Story-  Are you armed when you meet to sell a cell phone?   

You’re selling your phone on Craigslist.  It’s early in the evening when you agree to meet.  You pick a well lit public place to meet the buyer.  You arrive on time, and so does the buyer.  You both get out of your cars.  The buyer has a young man with him.  He asks to see the phone.  You reach for your pocket, and then the young man reaches for his pocket and pulls out a gun..that is soon pointed at you.  They demand your money and your phones.  You put them on the ground and back away.  Then they say they want anything you have in your car.  You walk around your car..and pull your gun from the center console.  You shoot the closest of the two robbers twice in the stomach.  The young thug with a gun runs.  You pick up your phones and call police.  They transport the wounded robber, and arrest the younger gunman as well.  You’re not hurt.

Elizabeth- On body carry

Rob- Is this a texas thing?  You can carry in your car without a permit.  Maybe he didn’t have his license.

Elizabeth-  Get your license.  Yes it is a pain, but do it.  This man could have been killed while his gun was 10 feet away.    The robbers let him go to his car and that saved his life.  He was lucky rather than smart.

Rob- It sounds like he moved to get his car between himself and the robbers.

Elizabeth- That was a good move.   He also acted decisively once he had his gun.  There is a time to talk and a time to use lethal force to defend your life.  Real life isn’t the movies.  Don’t talk when your life is at risk.  That is the time to stop the threat.

Rob- Do your students think that just having a gun will protect them?

Elizabeth- Some start that way..for a while.

Rob- you said you wanted to talk about the phone call.

Juliana- Yes. The victim also called police.  Before you do that, you don’t have to stand next to the victim while you’re holding your gun.  Get to a safe place.  Put your gun away.

Here is a hint about why on-body carry is such a good idea.  You not only have a gun with you, you have a place to put your gun away when you’re done.  Then you make the call so you can identify yourself as the victim.  Location, police and medical help, your name and description.  Practice that.

Rob- Do you have a training partner?

Elizabeth- Our third story happened last week in  Downey, California.

 

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Rob- Third story- Are you armed at your automobile audio shop in the evening?  

You’re working late at your car audio and alarm store.  Three men enter your shop.  Since people often leave their cars with you, that isn’t much of a surprise.  Two of the men are in their 30’s and one is a little younger.  You’re surprised when all of them draw handguns and say to hand over your money.  You walk toward the cash register, and grab your firearm.  News reports don’t say if your gun is behind the counter or on your body.

You shoot all three robbers..several times.  One of them manages to stumble away.  You retreat to the back of your shop and call police.

The escaping robber begs motorists for a ride to the hospital where he is arrested.  Police tell you the two other robbers died on your shop floor.

Elizabeth-  This man thought about the attack before it happened.  There were other robberies in the area.  He had a plan.  He knew he’d defend himself if he saw a lethal threat.  He did.

Rob- The victim was outnumbered.  How did he survive uninjured?

Elizabeth-  He waited until he saw an advantage and then he acted quickly and violently.  I have to call it violent because he went from looking like a willing victim to a violent defender in a fraction of a second.

Rob- That takes practice.

Elizabeth-  We’re practicing now.  He saw that his life was at risk.  He chose his moment and then he put his plan into place.  His plan was to shoot his attackers and survive.

Rob- It is a simple plan, but it takes some getting used to.

Elizabeth- It really does take some getting used to, but today we have time.  A new gun owner has to get there step by step.  They learn to safely handle a gun.  They learn to shoot accurately.  They learn to shoot quickly.  They learn to carry their gun.  Finally, they learn how to recognize a dangerous situation.  Each one of those is a manageable step.

Rob- So they don’t do it all in a single day in a single class?

Elizabeth- The victim also has to deal with southern California police.  He has to know what to say because every word can be used against him in court.

Rob- It doesn’t say if he had video security in his shop.

Elizabeth- I looked for that too.  That helps you win the second battle.

Rob- What is the second fight?

Elizabeth- You need to prove that you’re a good guy and acted responsibly.  If the evidence is clear enough then you won’t go to court.  Good guys want to be able to show what they did.

Rob- The news article said there were other robberies in the area.  I hope he had the video.

Exit- Rob- That wraps up this episode. Elizabeth, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

Elizabeth- I instruct in Colorado Springs.  I teach small classes at my private range in Black Forest.  Students can contact me at Colorado Boots Firearms Instruction.

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

Elizabeth-  If you liked this show, then you’ll like the other podcasts on the Self-defense radio network.  We create this podcast under a creative commons license, so please share it with a friend, and give us a rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- We’re now on itunes, Stitcher, and Google Play.

I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

 

Episode 66 with David Cole

Welcome to episode 66 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. Self-defense instructor David Cole joins us this week. We report and analyze examples of armed civilian defense. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you do in their situation? (17 minutes )

Rob- Introduction- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 66 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This podcast is for people who think they might want a firearm.. and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Dave Cole.

Hi, Dave.  How have you been?

Dave- Hi, Rob.  I’ve been busy, as usual.  Teaching, training, competing, and getting ready for an African safari…my work is never done!  

Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We’ll look at three examples of armed civilian defense.  Mental preparation is just as important as physical training, and we hope you use these reports as part of your training program; use your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Rob, we have a message from one of our listeners.  Bob said,

I was very disappointed when I heard Amber say her bank doesn’t allow concealed carry. Amber…change banks!  Our gun club had a couple of Certificate of Deposits at a local bank – until the bank put a sign up “prohibiting” weapons. We closed our account and told them why we were taking our CDs to their competitor’s bank down the street. Amber, your money speaks volumes!

Rob- Bob, thank you for writing in and thank you for all you do.  You probably never noticed those no-gun signs until you started carrying concealed in public.  You notice them now, and I want another million people on your side of the argument.

Dave, can you carry concealed in Kentucky banks?

Dave- As long as they are not posted.  Banks are private property, so the individual banks can make their own rules…fortunately, my bank does not post, and I believe that most do not. And I’d reiterate this from Bob’s comment: don’t just leave a business that posts “no gun” signs…speak to management and tell them WHY you’re taking your business elsewhere.

Our first story took place last week in Indianapolis, Indiana.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed in your apartment in the middle of the day?

School is out.  You’re at home with your four small children.  The oldest child is seven and the youngest is a newborn.  Your first sign of trouble is a crashing sound from down stairs. You wonder if the kids knocked something over.  Then you hear a man’s voice inside your apartment.  You grab your gun and fly down the stairs.  A young man is standing inside your broken door, and he has a gun.  You raise your pistol and fire.  Most wounds from a handgun aren’t incapacitating.  This one was.  Your attacker falls to the ground.  Your neighbors reported two other young men who ran away from the scene.  You and your children are uninjured.

Dave-  This incident is a prime example of why our defensive weapon should be on our person – at home.  Especially if there are children in the home.

Rob- Why is that?

Dave- Guns should never be left where unauthorized persons can get them.  At the same time, we have to consider how long it might take to access that gun when we need it.  Will there be time?  Where in your home is it, and will you be able to get to it? Where are your kids, and will you have to leave them behind to get to your gun? I’d imagine most people will have their secure storage in a bedroom or somewhere else, not in the main living area.  Think for a second about how most homes are set up, and where you spend the bulk of your time while at home.  How would you get to your defensive firearm in an emergency? Of course, if you simply keep your gun on your person, you don’t have to worry about any of this…it is always right where you need it, when you need it.

Rob- That reminds me of another listener comment I received. This listener took my challenge to go get his gun in his home. The listener walked quickly from his living room to his bedroom where he keeps his firearm.  He opened his safe, grabbed his handgun, and walked back to his living room.  It took him 31 seconds.

Dave- Half a minute is forever in an emergency.  Just ask anyone who has ever had to race for a gun during such a time! Home invasion can happen very quickly, and you may not have time to access a “staged” gun. Perhaps another useful exercise for the listener would be to time himself from his front door to his living room…the time it would take an attacker to reach him. Or if the two paths would intersect…how long from the front door to the intersection…that’s where you might bump into a bad guy on the way to your gun!

And one more point on home carry, Rob. We know that even armed, “clearing” a house is extremely dangerous, so we usually advise people that it’s better to arm yourself, and barricade yourself in a room and call police. If you have to go get your gun first, you’re increasing your risk…if your gun is on your person, you don’t have to move.

Also…where’s your phone to call the police? Mine is in my pocket, all the time, while I’m at home.

The gun wasn’t all that saved this family…a locked door made a difference, too.

Rob- How did the locked door help this young woman?

Dave-  The breaking of the door is what alerted her to the danger she and her children were in.  The door was her alarm.  It also added valuable response time. Even a few seconds can make the difference, and a locked door will at least slow down an attacker.

Rob-  Was lethal force justified?

Dave-  She faced an armed intruder.  State laws can vary a bit with things like castle doctrine and duty to retreat, but i don’t know of one that does not allow an armed response to an armed intruder in your home. Another factor is the presence of children in the home…the adult cannot simply flee and leave the children behind.

Rob-  So the law recognizes that you’re protecting your children?

Dave- Yes. We are typically allowed to use force to defend another who would have been justified in using the same level of force themselves. If the children would have been justified in using that force in self defense (and they would have been), then the mother can use that level of force to defend them. And even if she were alone, she could still articulate that she was reasonably in fear for her life or serious bodily injury, since the intruder was armed and inside her home. She was clearly in mortal danger.

Rob- Dave, you teach your students about a situation like this one.  How many times do you teach them to fire their gun?

Dave- We shoot to stop the threat, so we shoot until the threat is gone. Or, as I often put it, “shoot until they stop doing whatever it was that made you start shooting.”

Our second story also took place in Indianapolis.

Rob- Second Story-  Are you armed at home in the middle of the night?   

You and your family are asleep.  You hear the sound of breaking glass from the front of your house.  You grab your gun and investigate.  You see a young man standing in your living room.  You raise your handgun and fire.  The robber takes a few steps and falls.

You wife and children are uninjured.

Police say the robber was unarmed..this time. Two months ago he was arrested for possessing drugs and a stolen gun.  Last month he was arrested for hit-and-run with an automobile while intoxicated.  Last week the robber was arrested for theft and drugs.

Dave- Good the homeowner had a gun.  How about a flashlight?  Even in a state like Indiana that has a castle doctrine, you still want to be able to identify your target.  This is especially important in a home like this one, where there are other family members. Is that shape in the dark a bad guy, or just a family member who got up to use the bathroom in the night? Too often we hear of tragedies of mistaken identity that could have been prevented with a simple flashlight.

Rob-  So if you want to protect your home, first get a flashlight.

Dave-  Yes.  That is at the top of your emergency list.  Also, let’s talk about gun storage at night, when we’re asleep. Where do you keep your gun when you’re asleep?

Rob- Mine is in a quick access safe.  Why is that important? Why wouldn’t I just put my gun on my nightstand..or under the mattress?

Dave-  There are a couple of reasons. The first is secure storage.  You need your gun secured all the time.  Don’t leave a gun, even an unloaded gun, where children could get it.  Have you ever had one of your kids come into your bedroom at night? What if they picked up your gun off of your nightstand?

Also, consider the process of waking up. Even when we wake up startled…like to the sound of a window breaking…it takes a couple of seconds to orient ourselves. Using some sort of quick-access secure storage forces us to take a step before putting a gun in our hand, allowing time to clear our head and avoid a tragic mistake…especially in a home we share with others.

Rob- Not even if the gun is unloaded?

Dave- Not even if it is unloaded.  You are responsible to control that firearm all the time.  When it is on your body and when it is off.  It is your gun.  It doesn’t belong under the pillow.  I doesn’t belong between the mattresses.  You have to secure it…And be able to get to it quickly.

Rob- so you keep your home defense guns locked up, but loaded?

Dave- Yes. If it is not on my person, it’s secured. If it’s my defensive firearm, it’s loaded.

Rob- What else can we learn from this story?

Dave- The story doesn’t say who called the police, but it would be awesome if the wife was on the phone getting help.  A team effort…you deal with the threat, she gets the call out to police. Plan not just your response to a threat, but your whole family’s response.

Rob- Teamwork. David, I practiced those calls, and I was mumble mouthed until I practiced them several times.

Dave- That means our listeners have homework.  Our third story happened last week just west of Philadelphia.

Please support the Crime Prevention Research Center at
http://crimeresearch.org/

Rob- Third story- Are you armed when you’re walking down the street at mid-day?  

You and your friend are walking down the street just before noon on a Sunday morning.  Another man gets out of a car and approaches you.  He yells for you to stop.  He pulls a knife.  You and your friend back away.  You tell the attacker that you’re armed.  You draw your gun and hold it at the low ready.  Your attacker continues to advance toward you and your friend.  You raise your gun and shoot.

Your attacker grabs his leg.  The two people in the car drive away.  You call police.  You explain that you have your concealed carry permit.

Dave-  Bringing a knife to a gunfight? Not a good idea. I do hope that the shot in the leg wasn’t intentional. Despite what Hollywood tells us, it isn’t a great target.

Rob- Is this attack a one-in a million event?

Dave- Specifically, your odds of being a victim of violent crime in the US are about 4 out of 100, according to the FBI. http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/21/5-facts-about-crime-in-the-u-s/

But locally, your mileage may vary. In Philadelphia, the homicide rate this year is already up 19%, with 140 reported so far. https://www.phillypolice.com/crime-maps-stats/

Rob-  But during your lifetime, what are the realistic odds that you’ll be the victim of a violent attack?

Dave-  The short answer is: it depends. About one out of three of us will be attacked during our lifetime, but your milage may vary.  The longer version is that it depends greatly on specifically where you live, and your own behavior. People who consort with drug dealers, etc…tend to get dead more often than those of us who behave ourselves.

That said, I think the calculus is not that simple. We don’t want to consider just the odds of an attack, but the stakes involved…the consequences if it does happen. Living in a suburban area as I do, living the life of a law abiding citizen, I am probably about as likely to be attacked as I am to be struck by lightning…but people DO get struck by lightning, you know. So despite the fact that an attack may be unlikely, I am unwilling to accept the consequences of being defenseless if it does…so I am armed.

And remember, if you are a parent or responsible for small children, you are making this choice for them, too. To me, it is not worth risking the consequences of going unarmed.

 

Exit-  Rob- That wraps up this episode. Dave, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

Dave- My training company, Aegis Solutions LLC is on Facebook, and my articles on gun rights and more can be found at Black Man With A Gun…including my latest commentary on the recent attack on the GOP baseball practice. http://blackmanwithagun.com/shootout-or-massacre

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

Dave-  If you liked this show, then you’ll like the other podcasts on the Self-defense radio network.  We create this podcast under a creative commons license, so please share it with a friend, and give us a rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

https://drgo.us/

 

Episode 65 with Tony Simon

Welcome to episode 65 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. Firearms instructor Tony Simon joins us this week. We report and analyze examples of armed civilian defense. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you do in their situation? (17 minutes )

Rob- Introduction- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 65 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This podcast is for people who think they might want a firearm.. and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Tony Simon.

Hi, Tony.  How have you been?

Tony- Hi, Rob.  How have I been? I had ‘The Second is for Everyone’ diversity shoot a few days ago.  About 50 people came.

Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to use your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Tony- Our first story took place last week in Selma, Alabama.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed as you arrive home?  You and your wife arrive home just before midnight.  You park in your driveway and start to get out of your car.  A man runs out of the darkness and says, “give it up.”  He has a gun pointed at you.  You’re on the driver’s side and you reach for your gun.  The attacker shoots you, and then he runs toward the passenger side of the car.  You shoot him as he grabs your wife’s purse.  Then you call police.

You’re released from the hospital in a few hours.  Your attacker was a convicted felon.

Tony- Felons don’t obey gun laws so this guy got a gun and committed another armed robbery. You don’t know when you will become a victim of violent crime so follow the “Pants on-Gun on” motto

Rob- so what should we do?

Tony- Let’s put motion sensor lights on the house so the driveway lights up when you come home. Cut back bushes and shrubs from your house. If the bad guy doesn’t have the cover of darkness or a hiding place he has no location from which to launch an ambush. Bad guys won’t likely stand in the middle of a empty, well lit lawn.

Rob- I see.  It is better to avoid the fight than win one.

Tony- You can’t lose a fight that you never showed up to be in.  Also, if you and your spouse are armed the two of you being armed is 10 times more effective than one of you being armed. Two sets of eyes scanning for bad guys is more effective than one set.

Rob- My wife and I took training together.  But we have to practice.

Tony- You have to practice together.  You can do it as you’re walking down the street together, or walking at the mall. During this year’s NRA annual meeting in Atlanta my wife and I stayed alert and kept our heads on a swivel. We were effective because we do this no matter where we are going. Being aware of your surroundings  at all times should become a goal.

Rob- OK, so now I’ve got homework.

Tony- We all have homework.  The next thing is to have your gun on you.  This victim had to reach for his gun as if it were not on his body.  It could have been located in a bag or in a compartment inside the car.

Rob-  Getting a gun from his bag took time he didn’t have.

Tony-  He might have had the time later, but he didn’t have it right then.  What if the robber took whatever his gun was in or saw it inside of the car before the victim could reach it?

Rob- Yikes.  What do you mean he didn’t have time right then?

Tony- The robber had moved on to the other side of the car and his attention was elsewhere when the driver got his gun into the fight. Using a term that I learned from Ben Branum, the driver used “tactical patience” and attacked when the situation favored him. The victim was justified in going for his gun, but it is still our decision when we do it.  

Tony- Our second story happened last week in Wichita, Kansas.

Rob- Second Story-  Are you armed as you drive for Lyft?  You’re driving for Lyft.  It’s late at night on memorial day, and you think you’ll just take some people home after they have been partying too hard and too late.  You pick up two passengers who say they want to go to the zoo..in the middle of the night.  That sets off some alarm bells.  You drive them back to where you picked them up and a third man, one of their friends gets in the car as well.  That is when they start asking inappropriate questions.

You’re a married mom, and it sounds like they are looking for something else entirely.  One of the men grabs your breast.  You yell for him to stop and get out of the car.  He doesn’t move fast enough so you draw your firearm.  Now he moves.

You call police.

Being a stay at home mom seems like a better idea than driving for Lyft.

Tony- Could she have avoided the problem by letting her passengers out in front of a police station, or a major well-lit motel that has porters standing outside.  The staff will walk up to your window and ask if you want them to park your car.  That means you have a witness, and that alone will stop a lot of criminals.

Rob- she was in the driver’s seat..in more ways than one.

Tony- Right, but she didn’t have a plan of what to do if she had aggressive passengers.  Most gun owners don’t carry.  Most of the carriers only took enough training to get their license.  Thinking these things through helps you make better choices.

Rob-  Do you have students who drive a cab, or work for Lyft or Uber?

Tony- I have not had any students but both my Father-in Law and Mother-in- law drive and drove cabs for years. You should never take on fares by yourself.  Have a plan to get police to you or to get yourself to the police.

Our third story happened last week in Burlington, North Carolina.

Please support Buckeye Firearms Foundation at https://www.buckeyefirearmsfoundation.org/

Rob- Third story- Are you armed when you wash your car?  You’re washing your car early in the morning.  You see another car cruise by, and then it parks a few stalls away from you.  It’s an old car with lots of patches and half painted repairs.  Odd that they want to wash their car in the middle of the night.  You’re worried, so you grab your gun from your car.

A man steps around the concrete barriers between stalls.  He has a bandana over his face and he points his gun at you.  He says to give him your money.  You raise your gun and fire.  Your attacker runs away.  You’re not injured.  You call police.

Tony, what did the victim do right?

Tony- Rob, the victim was aware of his surroundings, he wasn’t distracted by having his earphones on and his head down.

Rob- He would have been disarmed if he hadn’t seen them coming.

Tony- And please have your gun on your body.  What if you were washing the passenger side of your car while the gun was over on the drivers side.  When you need a gun, you really need a gun. If it isn’t on you, you may spend the rest of your life trying to reach your defensive firearm.

Rob- again, that was time the victim didn’t have.

Tony- you know you said that before.

Rob- Well we make the same mistakes over and over.  Next week I’ll try and find new mistakes.

Tony- Most gun owners don’t have carry permits.  Lots of people with their permit don’t carry.  They would do so much better with just a little bit of training and a little thought. Training gives you things to think about that may never have crossed your mind.

Rob- In this example, what would your students learn

Tony- here are two obvious things.  First lesson is to move to keep the car between you and your attacker.  The second is to know how well you shoot.  Practice lets you know what you’re capable of doing.  It looks like the victim’s shot missed his attacker.  This was a psychological stop.  Please practice shooting quickly.  Not every range will let you do that.

Rob- Drawing quickly can be dangerous for new students, so you’d probably want to practice with and empty gun at first.

Tony- Please start with a class so you’re not practicing mistakes.  

Rob- better yet.

Tony- Don’t do what you see people do in the movies or on TV or Youtube.  We can show you how to do it safely and quickly.

We also tell everyone to win the race to the phone.  Be the first one to call the police.

Rob- You know that is three things you’d tell your students.  You said there were only two.

Tony- basic gun safety

How to shoot safely

How to defend yourself with a gun.

Exit-  Rob- That wraps up this episode. Tony, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

Tony-  I teach firearms safety and armed-self defense courses in New Jersey.  Our listeners can contact me on Facebook at Simon Says Train or at The Second is for Everyone. I’m also at SimonSaysTrain on Instagram.  My classes are listed at BlackBagResources.com

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

Tony-  If you liked this show, then you’ll like the other podcasts on the Self-defense radio network.  We create this podcast under a creative commons license, so please share it with a friend, and give us a rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

Give Lloyd a listen at http://www.armedlutheran.us/

Episode 64 with Amber Kunau

Welcome to episode 64 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. Firearms instructor Amber Kunau joins us this week. We report and analyze examples of armed civilian defense. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you do in their situation?

Rob- Introduction- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 64 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This podcast is for people who think they might want a gun for self-defense, and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Amber Kunau.

Hi, Amber.  How have you been?

 

Amber- Hi, Rob.  I’ve been busy.  School is out.

Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to exercise your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Amber- Our first story took place last week in Kingman, Arizona.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed at home in the afternoon?

 It is just after dinner when you hear someone coming through your front door.  You ask the stranger why he entered your house.  He pulls a stun gun and shocks you.  Several times.  You fall to the floor.  The robber starts gathering your possessions.  After a minute you can stand.  You grab your gun and shoot the robber.  You call police.  The robber is declared dead at the scene.  You’re not charged.

Amber, we get a lot of stories like this.

Amber- Most people are armed at home, but don’t carry in public.  This would have been so much better if he was armed from the start.

I want you to think about layers of protection. In security situations there are always layers. Businesses have layers of protection for their assets, everything from lights and landscaping to alarms. Your personal home should be no different. It is the world we live in. Keep your doors locked! It is your very first layer of protection.

Rob-  It is probably impossible to open a gun safe after you’ve been shocked.

Amber- This person was attacked with a non lethal weapon. Did they feel their life was in danger?

Rob-  The robber thought the victim was out of the fight.

Amber- Down, but not out.  He saved his own life.

Our second story happened last week in Mobile, Alabama.

Rob- Second Story-  Do you have a gun nearby early in the morning?

 That was a loud bang.  You’re not sure what it means until you hear people inside your apartment.  It’s five in the morning.  You lock your bedroom door, grab your gun and your phone.  A stranger kicks in your bedroom door, and you shoot him.  The stranger backs away and you stop firing.  You call police.  They arrest the robbers and take the wounded criminal to the hospital.

Amber- This person seems like they were prepared for this situation perhaps they took some firearms training in preparation for an intrusion like this.

Rob-  I want a gun, I want the door locked.  I want the police on the way, and I want all that in a hurry.  What do we need to do first?

Amber- You forgot to get a flashlight.  Were they able to identify this person as a threat or at least eliminate them as a known person, Gun training teaches students to make sure that this isn’t your kids friend or your wife etc.

Get your gun, your light, lock the door, get your phone, take cover, and call the police.

Rob-  If you have time, where should you hide in your room as you talk to police?

Amber- Far away from the door.  Set your line in the sand and defend yourself if an intruder crosses that line.

Amber- Our third story happened last week in Chicago, Illinois.

Please join and support the Second Amendment Foundation at SAF.org

Rob- Third story- Are you armed when you’re walking out of your bank at mid-day?

 You’re walking out of the local branch of your bank just before noon.  You head across the parking lot to your car when a young man approaches you.  He has a gun.  The gun is pointed at you.  “Give me your wallet,” he says.  You’re started.  You start to step back.  The robber raises his gun and says, “Now.”

You have your Illinois concealed carry license.  You’re gun is in your holster.  You draw and fire.  You shoot the robber twice in the chest and run.

The robber runs to his getaway car and leaves the scene.  An off duty police officer stops you.

Amber- Parking lots are dangerous places.  They are fringe areas away from the crowd of the business.  There is also easy access, so the thief can escape quickly.  That means we want our head up before we step out of the business.

Rob- Having your head down as you hold your wallet is an invitation to get robbed, isn’t it.

Amber- Don’t look like an easy victim.

Rob- Amber, let’s say one of your students is facing someone who is holding a gun on them in a parking lot.  What do you want your student to do in this situation?  

 

Amber-  Not all banks allow concealed carry this is something beneficial you can find out in a firearms class always check postings

Rob- Mine does.  What do you tell the officer who stops you.

Amber- Obey the officer.  Answer his questions.  When he asks, say ‘Thank goodness you’re here.  I was assaulted.  I have a permit to carry.  I defended myself, and I’ll like to file a complaint against the person who assaulted me.

Rob- Should you say much more?

Amber- A few details, but wait until you’ve talked with your lawyer.  You and your lawyer will give a complete report..tomorrow.

Exit-  Rob- That wraps up this episode. Amber, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

Amber- I instruct and compete in Phoenix, Arizona.  Listeners can contact me at Instructor Amber K on my Facebook page.

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

Amber-  If you liked this show, then you’ll like the other podcasts on the Self-defense radio network.  We create this podcast under a creative commons license, so please share it with a friend.  It’s been weeks since we’ve had a new rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.Listen to Gun Freedom Radio at http://gunfreedomradio.com

Episode 63 with Robyn Street

Welcome to episode 63 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. Firearms instructor Robyn Street joins us this week. Together, we report and analyze examples of armed civilian defense. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you do in their situation?

Rob- Introduction- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 63 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This show is for  people who think they might want a gun for self-defense, and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Robyn Street.

It has been a while since we’ve talked.  I know you’ve been busy.

Robyn – I have been busy.  Lots of training and range events.  It is fun and exciting but definitely busy.  I hear that you recently took a class.

Rob-  My wife and I took the beginning class for armed civilians put on by the Massad Ayoob Group.

Robyn- I am glad that we have had a chance to catch up and let’s not forget to say

Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners.

You know that I use our self defense gun stories with my Well Armed Woman Group.  It is a great way to prepare for what might happen.  Let’s get started reporting and analyzing our three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to exercise your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Robyn- Our first story took place last week in Houston, Texas.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed at home early in the morning?  You’re home with your family.  Your brother and his family live next door.  It is about 4 am when you hear sounds from your brother’s house.  You hear shouts and screams. And that gets you moving.  You grab your rifle and head next door.  You approach their house and the front door is open.  Someone is inside, and they start to run.  You enter the house and strangers are heading from the bedroom toward the back door.  You look in the bedroom and see your relatives tied up.  One of their attackers is armed, and you start shooting.  You shoot two of the attackers, but two of them got away.

Your relatives, including your niece two nephews, were roughed up, but not injured.

Robyn- Victim needs to harden their home

Rob- There are layers over layers to this story.  How could you slow down the attackers and give you more time.  What would you do once your home was invaded.  How would you gather and defend your family.  You can’t invent those plans in the moment.

Robyn – You need to talk with your family ahead of time.  One part of the family was used as hostages to get compliance from the other parts of the family.  Escape out the window if you must.

Rob- The robbers were armed.

Robyn- Call 911 and get help on the way.  Call family members to see if they are OK.  He did not even know what was going on when he headed over with his rifle.

Robyn – How did the attacker get into the home?  We are told the door was open.  (really? RM)

Robyn – Would you really want to be walking around with a rifle? .  How would frightened family members/police/other responders react?

Rob- How does your choice of firearm matter?

Robyn – Definitely need a good flashlight so you can identify the attackers.  You don’t want to shoot your family on accident.

Rob- Some of the attackers were shot in the back yard.

Robyn – If the attackers are running away let them go.  If they are still presenting a deadly threat then you would have to defend yourself and your family members.

Rob- what would you tell your students about this story?

Robyn – If you want to be a hero, start now by helping others prepare for/prevent a potential attack.  Encourage them to listen to SDGS and discuss preparations and awareness with them.

Robyn- Our second story happened last week in Asheville, North Carolina

Rob- Second Story-  Are you armed when you stop at a convenience store in the evening?  You’re waiting your turn in the checkout line. Two teenagers come into the store and start yelling.  It was hard to understand them.  Then you saw that they had weapons in their hands and were yelling at the store clerk.  That was easy to understand.  The clerk opened the cash drawer.  One of the robbers shot a taser at the clerk, and missed.  You have your concealed carry permit.  You are carrying.  The second robber raises his firearm, and you’re afraid he’s going to kill the clerk.  You draw and shoot the armed robber.  The two robbers run from the store.

The clerk and the two other customers in the store are uninjured.  The clerk calls police.  You tell them your story.  The police look at the store video and then let you go home.

Robyn- Good for you for having your firearm with you.  Prepared for a potential attack.

Rob- the robbers showed they were willing to use force because they tazed the clerk.  That grabs everyone’s attention.

Robyn- Tunnel vision.

Rob- What else did you notice?

Robyn- Obviously wasn’t a physical stopping shot since the attackers were able to run away.  It was a psychological stopping shot since the attackers decided to change their plans and run away.

Rob- You’re in a gun battle with multiple moving attackers.

Robyn – If I would have been in line and was not the focus of the attack, I would have been looking for other attackers and avenues of escape.  I am not responsible for the safety of everyone in the store.  It is a decision that each person has to make.  By inserting yourself into the situation, you are risking life, liberty and your finances to defend others.  It is a decision that you should think about now…What would you do?

Rob- You’re talking about planning again, aren’t you.

Robyn- It sounds so simple to describe the situation now, but it will feel all-consuming in the moment it happens.  Of course, this situation could quickly evolve to include you as the focus of this attack.  If you are threatened with death, you would have to defend yourself.  

Rob- and by that point you might have given up the element of surprise.  This isn’t an easy decision.

Robyn- Our third story happened last week in Grady county, Oklahoma.  That makes two stories where a third party saved other people being threatened.  Are you going for all three this week?

Rob- You’ll find out after this message for Coloradans for Civil Liberties.

Please support Coloradans for Civil Liberties

Rob- Third story- Are you armed when you’re at home at two in the morning?  You’re asleep in your bed when you hear a loud bang.  You and your wife sit up.  Your three kids are down the hall. You hear more noises from the front of the house and you grab your firearm to investigate.  You run into an intruder.  Your gun is up and you yell for him to leave.  You walk him to your front door and yell for him to get on his knees.  The intruder walks through your broken front door and kneels.  You hear your wife talking to police behind you.  The police are already on their way because a neighbor called about an intruder who tried to get into her front door.

Your wife stays on the phone and describes the situation to police. They arrest a known drug user who admitted to using methamphetamine and LSD.  The family were uninjured.

Robyn – Your neighbor must had a better door than you.  Harden your home.

Rob- It sounds like this family had a plan.  Mom grabbed the phone.

Robyn – Prepare your family now so everyone know what is expected if someone breaks in.  

Rob- teamwork

Robyn – Wife’s actions were essential.  You can’t hold someone at gunpoint, call the police and make sure that your children are OK.  Teamwork.

Rob- the homeowner grabbed the intruder.

Robyn- If the attacker is willing to go away and no longer pose a threat to you and your family, I would let them go.  Learning how to properly detain someone and/or clearing a house requires training.  Think about what would you might have to do do now and prepare yourself.

Rob- I’ve shot with you.  Do you have that training?  Not many of us do.

Exit- Rob- That wraps up this episode. Robyn, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

Robyn- I teach in Naples Florida, and listeners can find me at Step by Step Gun Training.com.  We provide custom training courses as well as group classes.  They can also contact us on Facebook.

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

Robyn-  If you liked this show, then you’ll like the other podcasts on the Self-defense radio network.  We create this podcast under a creative commons license, so please share them with a friend, and give us a rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

Episode 62 with Jeff Street

Welcome to episode 62 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. Firearms instructor Jeff Street joins us this week. Together, we report and analyze examples of armed civilian defense. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you do in their situation?

Introduction- Rob- I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 62 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This show is for  people who think they might want a gun for self-defense, and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Jeff Street.

It’s great to talk with you again, Jeff.  What have you been up to?

 

Jeff- Hi, Rob.  Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to exercise your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

Jeff- Our first story took place last week in Decatur, Alabama.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed at work? You work on the back dock of a roofing supply company.  You’re around construction and material handling equipment all day long as you move materials and set up customer’s orders.  It isn’t unusual to yell so you can hear each other over the noise of the equipment, but this yelling is different.  One of your customers is yelling at one of your co-workers.  You stop to see what is happening.  You see the customer pull a firearm and point the gun at one of your co-workers.  He isn’t showing off the gun, he is threatening to hurt your co-worker.  You draw your own gun and fire twice at the attacker.  Then you’re the one doing the shouting as you yell for someone to call the police.

Jeff, what would you tell your students if they were in this situation?

 

Jeff- This may be an example of involving yourself in the conflicts of others.   We don’t know all the details.  Was the employee the only one threatened by the customer?  How well do you know the involved coworker?  Are you willing to put your life in danger for them?  Can you assist without putting other coworkers in greater danger?

Rob- What do we need to know before we get involved?

Jeff- You need to figure these things out ahead of time.  Make a list of the people you would be willing to die for or spend the rest of your life in jail for.  My wife Robyn is on that list.  The world will miss her more than me.  Putting myself in jeopardy for someone else will potentially deprive my wife of me.

Rob- Should you protect strangers in a movie theater, but not in the mall?  Should you protect your mother in law, but not your brother in law?

Rob- What did the responder do correctly?

Jeff- Our second story happened last week in La Porte, Texas.

Rob- Second Story-  Are you armed at home in the evening?  Your daughter wanted to buy a cell phone.  She found a used one at a price she wanted to pay.  She agreed to meet the buyer at a public place.  The police have an area of their parking lot set up with cameras for trades like this.  They seller was late, so your daughter agreed to meet the seller at your home.

Your daughter asked to see the phone and make sure it worked before she handed over the money. Your wife was standing nearby, and the buyer grabbed your wife.  He grabbed your wife  by the hair and demanded the money.  Your wife yelled and you looked from inside your house.  Your daughter yelled that she’d go get the money from inside the house.  You saw the stranger with a gun pointed at your wife’s head.  You walked to the front steps and leaped at the buyer, knocking him away from your wife.  Rather than run away, the attacker again demanded the money.  You said you’d get it.  You walked inside and grabbed your handgun.  The attacker raised his gun as you came outside.  You shot him once in the low- center chest.  Now the attacker ran away.  The driver waiting in his car sped away with the injured attacker.  Now you call police.

Jeff- Late buyer should be a red flag.  We never invite strangers to our home.  Would have been better is someone involved in the exchange on the good guy side of the balance sheet had been armed.  

Rob-  When is lethal force justified, when is it necessary, and when is it advantageous?

Jeff- The criminal was armed.

Rob- That shows he threatened us with lethal force.  When should we shoot?

Jeff-  Low center chest was not an instant stop shot.  At that point. our violent criminal actor was convinced that retreat was a good option.   

Rob- I like it that he went hand to hand rather than stand there when his wife was threatened.

 

 

Jeff- Our third story happened last week in Chicago, Illinois.

Give Lloyd a listen at http://www.armedlutheran.us/

Rob- Third story- Are you armed when you walk to your car?  

You had to get something from your car.  It is parked on the street.  It is almost noon, and two men approach you as you reach for the door.  One of the men has a gun.  They demand your car keys and wallet.  You are licensed to carry a concealed handgun in Chicago.  You’re armed.  You reach for your keys and then present your firearm.  You shoot the armed robber.  He drops his gun.  Both men run away.  You stop firing and call the police.

Jeff-  When approaching your car, you should give an extra look around.  Maybe they would not have selected you.  This is Chicago and they most likely believe that you are not armed.  I will not ever live in Chicago or any other gun unfriendly city.

Rob- What if he saw them.  What should he do next?

 

Jeff- Distraction worked.  Reaching into your pocket for the keys or putting them on the car might have diverted their attention and slowed their reaction time.  That gave the defender more time to act.

Rob- It sounds like only one of the attackers had a firearm.

Jeff- Notice that in the last case and this one both perpetrators were not immediately immobilized from a handgun wound (like in the movies).  Calling the police is very important.  We recommend the say little approach.  In order to accomplish the say little approach I recommend vigorous listening to SDGS and thinking about what you would tell 911, the arriving police, and your attorney after the fact.

 

 

Exit-  Rob- That wraps up this episode. Jeff, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

Jeff-  My wife and I teach in Naples Florida, and our listeners can learn more about us at Step by Step Gun Training.com.  We provide custom training courses as well as weekly group classes.  Our listeners can also find us on Facebook.

Rob- Please leave your comments and questions on the podcast facebook page.  

Jeff-  If you liked this show, then you’ll like the other podcasts on the Self-defense radio network.  We create this podcast under a creative commons license, so please share them with a friend.  It has been a couple months since we received a rating on on I-Tunes, so we can use your help.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

Please support the Crime Prevention Research Center at
http://crimeresearch.org/

 

Episode 61 with David Cole

Welcome to episode 61 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. Firearms instructor David Cole joins us this week. Together, we report and analyze examples of armed civilian defense. Were these gun owners lucky, or were they prepared? How would you do in their situation?

Introduction- Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  Welcome to episode 61 of Self-Defense Gun Stories.  This show is for  people who think they might want a firearm for self-defense, and those who already have one.  We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor David Cole.

Hi, David.  How have you been?

David- Hi, Rob.  Seems like just yesterday we were hanging out at the NRA Annual Meetings & Exhibits in Atlanta. It sure was a great show this year.

Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense.  We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to exercise your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow.  Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.

David- Our first story took place last week in Jacksonville, Florida.

Rob- First story-  Are you armed when you arrive home?  You return home at about 10 in the morning.  Unfortunately, a robber is waiting for you.  He follows you to the door and forces his way inside.  He then tries to take your purse and you phone.  You fight.  You grab your handgun and shoot your attacker.  He runs from your home.  You slam the door and call the police.  The police arrest your attacker when he called for medical attention.

David- Fortunately, our good citizen was prepared…she had a gun handy and was ready to use it.

Rob-  We can’t tell how she got her gun.  What do you tell your students?

David- She also did the right thing by calling 911 and reporting the incident.

David- Our second story happened last week in Memphis, Tennessee.

Rob- Second Story-  Are you armed at work late at night.  You work at a liquor store.  It is never completely safe.  Yesterday, the police visited your store to warn you about a series of liquor store robberies in the area.  It is 11 at night when a man walks in wearing a ski mask.  It isn’t cold outside.  The masked man presents a gun and starts yelling at you to get down on the floor.  You draw your pistol and shoot your attacker several times.  You back away and call police.  No one else was injured.  The FBI links the attacker to eight other robberies.

David- This one was kind of obvious, but sometimes it can be difficult to see trouble coming. But a guy in a ski mask in a liquor store at 11 PM is most likely not your friend.

Rob- Talk about a risky occupation.  The police told him to be ready..and he was.

David- The clerk was prepared with a gun of his own, and did what he had to do to defend himself.

Rob- Should we do what a criminal demands?

David- That’s a tough call, and the only 100% correct answer is “it depends.” But compliance doesn’t increase our chances of going home unhurt. There are plenty of examples of robberies where the victim gave the robber what they demanded, and were shot anyway.  My personal opinion is that you are taking a big chance when you count on mercy from someone willing to threaten your life for your purse or wallet.

David- Our third story happened last week in Arlington, Texas.

Please support Buckeye Firearms Foundation at https://www.buckeyefirearmsfoundation.org/

Rob- Third story- Are you armed when you visit a sports bar?  You’re sitting in a sports bar with family and friends when you hear the yelling.  A stranger is yelling at everyone.  The restaurant manager goes over to talk the the man.  The stranger is upset, and the manager is trying to calm him down.  The stranger yells louder, then he pulls a gun from his pocket and shoots the manager.  You tell your wife to get on the floor.  You crouch down and draw your own firearm.  People are running wildly.  The attacker is shooting towards people as they run for the front door.  The crowd thins for a second and you take your shot.  The attacker stops shooting.  You and your family leave the scene, but you don’t go far.  You know you have to talk to police.  They say the attacker had two guns and two knives on him.  The manager died at the scene..along with the attacker.  The only other injury was one customer he cut himself on the broken glass as he left.

David-  This one had the potential to be much, much worse..but for a good guy with a gun. And it seems like this week’s theme could easily be Jeff Cooper’s first rule of gunfighting: “Have a gun.”

Rob-

David- Laws regarding carry in bars vary from state to state

Exit- Rob- That wraps up this episode. David, thank you for helping me today.  Where can our listeners learn more about you?

David- Our listeners can find me at

Rob- Our listeners can share their thoughts with us by leaving a message on the podcast facebook page.  

David-  If you liked this show, then you’ll like the other podcasts on the Self-defense radio network.  We create this podcast under a creative commons license, so please share them with a friend, and give us a rating on I-Tunes.

Rob- I’m Rob Morse.  We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.

Learn more at SAF Training Division.