Rob- Introduction-Welcome to episode 111 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. This podcast is for people who might want a gun for self-defense, and for those who already have one. I’m your host, Rob Morse. We have firearms instructor Amanda Suffecool with us as co-host.
Hi, Amanda. How have you been?
Amanda- Hi, Rob. I’ve been busy training and building houses. We have held a woman’s day on the range this past weekend, and I have just been asked to speak at the Heller-ten event in DC on the 10th anniversary of the Heller vs DC decision. So – as they say, what have you been up to… nothing much. What about you – Rob
Rob- I practiced at the range, and received an order of ammunition for a training class I’m taking. Please introduce our podcast to our new listeners.
Amanda- We study three recent examples of armed defense. These gun owners survived a life threatening situation because they were armed. What should we do in their place?
Our first story took place last week in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. Here’s what happened.
You walk out of a restaurant when you hear shots coming from inside. The restaurant is posted as a gun-free zone, so you left your gun in your car. You run back and grab your handgun. You see people streaming out of the building and you work your way upstream looking for the problem. You see injured people lying on the ground. You shout asking, “Where is the shooter,” and people point out the side door. You follow them.
You see a man standing in the parking lot with a gun in his hands. You yell for him to drop the gun. He turns toward you and fires. You shoot back. The attacker drops to the ground. You look around and see another civilian with a gun pointed at the attacker. You nod to him and step back.
Then you remember that your holser is in your car. You stay at the scene. Police arrive a few minutes later.
Amanda- had a gun (wasn’t on him, but he had one.) This is why gun free zones are such an issue with pro 2A folks
Amanda- The defender took a risk – one that you would want someone to do if you were one of the injured, but one that is a concern on its own. He ran toward the problem
Amanda- More than one defender. When the first defender stopped shooting, the second defender lowered his gun. They were both reticent to shoot, and that is exactly the attitude we want.
Amanda- Our second story happened last week in Worcester, (woo’-ster) Massachusetts.
You’re working behind the counter at a small market. It is 8:40 in the evening. You hear a lady scream and look up. A man is standing behind the woman and has a knife at her throat. The attacker says this is a robbery. You see the fear in the woman’s face and put your hand on your gun. The woman drops to the ground. You draw and shoot the attacker three times. He runs from the store and you call police.
The police arrest the attacker outside your store.
Amanda- He didn’t wait until the man with the knife was close to him. But at the same time – it’s was obvious that the guy with a knife was a threat.
Amanda- This clerk honored the witnesses. He defended an innocent person..and then stopped shooting.
Amanda- Our third story happened last week in Nashville, Tennessee.
It is almost 11 at night. You hear a car horn and hear your mom yell from the front of your home. She is driving behind your home and still honking her car horn. You grab your gun and open the back door. You see a man pointing a gun at your mom. He points his gun at you and fires. You shoot back. The robbers run and you call police.
Police said the teens may have been involved in two other overnight armed robberies.
Amanda- In all three cases, the defenders were involved while defending a third party of a family member.
Rob- It happens.
Amanda- It happens, and we have to think about it ahead of time.
Amanda- The first rule of a gun fight is have a gun. Our defender did not have time to go outside, assess the situation, and then go get his gun. He had his tools on him.
Rob- and he used them.
Amanda- Unfortunately, he missed. 11 at night, low light, hard to see the sights. Perhaps its the length of the shot – a shot from your back door to the parking lot.
Rob- Do you teach that to your students?
Exit- Rob- That wraps up this episode. Amanda, thank you for helping us today. Where can we learn more about you?
Rob- Introduction-I’m Rob Morse and welcome to episode 80 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. This podcast is for the people who think they might want a firearm.. and those who already have one. We’re joined this week by self-defense instructor Ben Branam.
Ben- Hi, Rob. I drained the savings account, bought supplies, and took the truck down to the coast. That is what we do.
Rob- Two of our instructors went through the eye of hurricane Irma. Jeff and Robyn Street live in Naples Florida. They prepared well and did well. They have water and power, so they have air conditioning, but they don’t have phone or internet yet. Best wishes to Jeff and Robyn.
Ben- Hi to our new listeners, and welcome back to our regular listeners. We report and analyze three examples of armed civilian defense. We hope you use these reports as part of your exercise program.. to use your imagination today so you can defend the people you care about tomorrow. Please leave us a message on our facebook page with your questions or comments.
Ben- Our first story took place last week near Seattle, Washington.
You’re at home with your mom and your kids. Your older kids are at school, but your young ones are at home taking a nap. You’re not expecting visitors, but you hear someone knocking on your front door. Before you can answer it, you hear a tearing sound coming from your children’s bedroom. You grab your gun and run to your kid’s room. A man has torn out the window fan and is climbing through the window next to your kids. Another man is standing next to him with his hands on the sill ready to jump in. You shoot him the nearest intruder. Both men run away. You call police.
Ben- That isn’t exactly what happened. You don’t “get your gun”. Those few words hide something that can take half a minute. Let’s be realistic. You have more time to fight a fire in your kitchen than to fight an intruder in your childrens’ bedroom..and I keep a fire extinguisher on the kitchen wall. Please have a gun with you.
Rob- Why did this man need a gun?
Ben- he was outnumbered and his children were in immediate danger. Our armed citizen had an intruder in his home within feet of his kids and another intruder next to him.
Whew. I’m a dad, and that gets me excited.
Let me explain. You had intruders break into your home by force and without your permission.
They had immediate access to your children.
You were outnumbered.
Rob- You don’t have many options.
Ben- Not any good ones..and you don’t have time to think. You have seconds to act, and you put your children in danger if you delay.
Rob- So what did our dad do right?
Ben- He grabbed the tool he needed. He used it. He stopped using it. He probably took care of his screaming kids, because I’m sure they were freaked out by the break in. Then, someone got their brain back online and called the police.
Rob- That sounds so simple.
Ben- Yeah, it does, but it isn’t. You have to break it down to really simple steps, because even doing simple things is hard when your family is at risk and you’re going a little crazy inside yourself.
Rob- Wow. Keep breathing. I’m getting wrapped up in it, and it’s only a story.
Ben- Yep, breathing helps. Having a plan helps a lot.
Rob- You call it a plan.
Ben- A checklist. Have your tools with you. Recognize an immediate threat. Defend the people you love. Treat the injured. Call the police. There are not a lot of moving parts. Just a few steps.
Rob- Have a plan.
Ben- Yep, have a plan, and ready or not, our second story happened last week in ALBUQUERQUE, N.M
You’re a mother with two children and you’re working in a Circle-K gas station. A customer tells you that a nearby 7-11 has just been robbed af few minutes ago. You’re concerned, so you walk to your car and get your gun. You don’t have a carry permit, so you open carry with your legally owned gun in your pocket. You also lock one of the side doors to the convenience store.
It is the usual busy time at 4 in the afternoon. There are several customers in the store and at the gas pumps. A man walks in wearing a ski mask, carrying a bag, and holding a gun. He screams that everyone is to get down on the ground.. except you. He waves his gun at the customers, and then points the gun at you. The robber tells you to put the money into the bag. You do. You hand him the bag, and draw your gun. You shoot him once in the chest. The robber drops his gun and runs from the store. Police find him behind the building. They are looking at the surveillance video to see if he robbed the other store as well.
Ben- Good for her. The first lesson is to be armed.
Rob- she was.
Ben- Better yet, spend the $100 for a permit so you can concealed carry.
Rob- Why is that important?
Ben- You want to act when you have the best chance to win. There is no advantage to communicate that you’re armed in this situation. I don’t want this young lady to be shot if the robber sees her gun.
Rob- at least she was armed in time.
Ben- Yes. Once you have your gun, then, I want you to have tactical patience. I want you to cheat. Don’t get into a fast-draw contest if you can avoid it. I’m fast, but I want all the good guys to cheat if they can. If you are in a “fair fight” you did something wrong.
Show some tactical patience until you have an advantage. Then act as violently as you can. Surprise, Speed and Violence of action will win all the time.
Rob- Really? Be as violent as you can?
Ben- Is it the life of your spouse, your child, or your friend that is on the line? They don’t deserve to die. You don’t deserve to die either. Do as much as you can to stop a lethal threat. Keep going until the threat isn’t there. Is that running away, or emptying your magazine and reloading? I don’t know. I won’t be there. That is why I’m begging you to do your mental homework now.
Rob- But Ben.
Ben- But nothing. This woman was terrified because she thought she was going to die. She didn’t start the fight. She didn’t want the fight. When the fight comes to you, then fight for your life. This woman saved the life of her customers. I hope she waved the bag in front of her. Set the bag on the counter, and then drew her gun and fired as she stepped to the side.
Ben- And if the bad guy runs away, then stop. Starting is hard. So is stopping. Maybe stopping is even harder. It is hard to tell. The clerk was pretty shaken up, but call police if you can.
Rob- There is more to say. There is, but that is enough for now.
Ben- Our third story happened last week in Winston-Salem, North Carolina.
You and your wife are at home in your apartment on a Saturday afternoon. You’re both in your late 70s. Your wife answers a knock at the door, and she is thrown back into the room as two young men smashed their way inside. Before you know what is happening, the two intruders start beating you with a club. You fall down, but you grab the gun in your waistband as you fall. You roll to the side and shoot the attacker standing over you. Both attackers run. You call police and EMTs. You and your wife go to the hospital.
Ben- The man was an army veteran. He had a gun on him, at home, on a sunny weekend afternoon. And he needed it.
Rob- He was on his knees with two attackers beating him, and he won.
Ben- He had the physical tools and he had the mental tools to use them.
Rob- Down but not out of the fight.
Ben- He wounded one attacker. They ran. That stopped the attack on him and his wife. Great job.
Rob- What would you tell your students?
Ben- He did a great job, but I wish he could have avoided the fight. I ask my students to buy an electronic doorbell so they can see who is outside.
Rob- That would have kept the bad guys outside?
Ben- It would have bought our good guys more time as the thugs had so smash their way into the house.
Rob- Anything else?
Ben- I wish that they had both been armed because I don’t want either one of these nice old people beaten up.
Rob- That would make a difference?
Ben- If they were both armed and had worked together even a little bit, then these two young guys wouldn’t stand a chance.
Rob- Really!? Even if it were two guys in their 20s against a couple in their late 70s?
Ben- You know how hard it is for one person to fight off two attackers. Now imagine how hard it is to hurt two people who can defend themselves at a distance. It is so much of an advantage that it makes the bad guys look silly. I talk about it on my podcast. The male homeowner yells. The bad guys move toward him, and his wife has all the time in the world to stop the problem. She can draw slowly and aim..and she’ll own them.
Rob- If they work together and have a plan.
Ben- And if they are both armed.
Exit- Rob- Thank you, Ben. That wraps up this episode. Where can our listeners learn more about you?
Ben- Our listeners can find me at Modern Self Protection.com. I live in San Antonio, and most of my classes are in central Texas. Listeners can see my complete class schedule at my website, and they can also listen to my podcast Modern Self-Protection.