Episode 140 with David Cole
Rob- Introduction- I’m glad you found us and welcome to episode 140 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. This podcast is for people who are curious about a firearm for self-defense, and for those who already own one. I’m your host, Rob Morse. We’re joined this week by self defense instructor David Cole. What have you been up to, David?
David- Hi, Rob. I’ve been working and practicing. (And loading ammo for the upcoming USPSA season)
Rob- I’m looking for a spanish speaking podcaster who will make a spanish version of Self-Defense Gun Stories. If you know someone, then please ask them to contact us. Until then, David, please introduce our podcast to our new listeners.
David- We study several examples where gun owners survived a life threatening situation. Were they lucky, or did they have a plan? What should we do if we were in their place? Our first story took place last week in Detroit, Michigan.
You’ve walked out of your brothers house. Now, you’re sitting in your car, while you check your phone, update the map, and let your car warm up. Suddenly there are three men dressed in black with masks over their faces standing around your car and they demand you give them your wallet. You have your Michigan Concealed Pistol license. You’re armed, though both your wallet and your gun are buried deep under your coat.
A minute ago the darkness was working for your attackers when they moved toward your car. Now you’re fuddling in your car, pulling off your gloves, grabbing your gun and they can’t see what you’re doing. You shoot the attacker who’s reaching through your car window. All three attackers run away.
You go back into your brother’s house and call police. That gun is really loud.
David- Flashlights work both ways. Or more precisely, lack of a flashlight works both ways. I always had a light with me when I approached a motorist during a traffic stop.
Rob- What do you like about what our defender did to protect himself?
David- On the positive side, he acted decisively. Also, it appears that he used the darkness to conceal his draw from his attackers. This is one of those cases where the decision whether to comply and hand over the wallet or to fight is a difficult one…he was facing three attackers alone.
Rob- What would you tell your students to do?
David- First of all, sitting in a car (especially in the dark) is a vulnerable position to be in, and I try to minimize the time I’m just sitting in my vehicle in the first place. I always lock the doors right away, then start it up and put it in gear, with my foot on the brake. I try to minimize any “stuff” I need to do once I get in…I’m not fiddling with my phone, etc. I want to secure myself and the vehicle, and get rolling as quickly as possible.
On the gun side, consider your mode of carry. How accessible is your gun when seated in a car? While there are carry methods which work well in this position (shoulder holster, cross draw, ankle), they are more specialized and have their own downsides. For most people, those disadvantages outweigh the advantages. No carry method is the best in every situation, and you need to find the one which works for your life…and then practice with it.
That’s the next thing…practice. I carry in a belt holster just behind my hip, with the understanding that it is going to be more difficult to draw in a seated position. But regardless of your method of carry, drawing while in your car requires some dedicated practice (and maybe even a class). There are trainers who offer classes dedicated to fighting in and around your car, and professional guidance is always a good thing.
Rob- How do you practice this? It has to be hard enough fumbling with a coat and gloves.
David- If you are going to practice on your own, consider purchasing a blue gun which matches your carry gun. You are going to make some mistakes as you work out your draw and presentation, and you do not want to have an accident doing something which is supposed to make you safer! They aren’t terribly expensive, and are a good accessory to have for other practice as well. Also, consider where you are going to do this practice…no need to upset the neighbors if they see you in your car with a gun! Then consider how you will clear your cover garment to access your gun, and then draw and present it without muzzling yourself. It is very easy to end up pointing your gun at your own arm if you don’t pay attention to what you are doing…and shooting yourself is not the best beginning to your gunfight.
Rob- Anything else?
David- That is enough for now. Our second story happened last week in Atlanta, Georgia.
There are several people in the apartment tonight. You’re in your room when you hear shouts from the front door. Someone yells, “They’ve got guns.” That shocked and frightened you. Your apartment is being robbed. You grab your gun, slowly open your bedroom door, and peek down the hall into the front room. Two strangers are pointing guns at your roommates. The robbers demand their money and phones. You slip down the hall and shoot the robber closest to you. Both robbers turn to run. One of them falls as he reaches the front door.
Everyone calls police.
David- The woman was armed. Good for her, because without a gun she and her roommates would have been victims of an armed robbery..or worse.
Rob- Should she have stayed in her room?
David- That’s a really tough call, since there were other innocents in the apartment. I’m sure it would have been safer for her, but do you leave your roommates to fend for themselves, or do you go help? That’s a difficult decision (one that’s good to think about in advance). Some considerations might be how solid was her bedroom door? Is barricading in that room a viable option. Were the robbers going to go door to door looking in each room? Were they going to kill the roommates and then come looking for witnesses? By taking action, she got to shoot at the time and situation of her choosing.
Rob- What would you tell your students to do?
David- Moving alone (without a team) inside a structure with a gun is another one of those skills which benefits from professional instruction. And even done properly, it is VERY risky and there are no 100% safe ways to do it. This is why we usually advise people to barricade in place and call police in a situation like this, but there may be times when you need to move…children in the home and in another room, for example. This scenario was much like that.
Rob- When would your students learn to do that?
David- Our third story happened last week in Chicago, Illinois.
Rob- First this message from the Second Amendment Foundation.
Please join and support the Second Amendment Foundation at SAF.org
You’re walking past the park on your way home to your apartment. You’re returning home from work and a man crosses the park towards you. He tells you to stop. The man lunges for you and tries to grab your purse. You push him away, and now he’s trying to knock you down onto the ice sidewalk. You draw your gun and shoot at your attacker. Now he runs away. You hear a car door slam and see a dark car drive away. You rush home and call police.
David- She fought off her attacker. She had a gun. She fled to safety. Good job.
After 140 of these podcasts, I’ve noticed a theme. We start each segment with “are you armed?” Are you trying to hint that it’s a good idea to carry all the time? (And just a few years ago, this woman likely would not have been able to get a permit in Chicago)
Rob- What should we learn?
David- A really good takeaway from this situation is that even though she stopped her attacker and no one was hurt, she got to a position of safety and called police.
Rob- Do you practice getting your gun out from your winter coat?
David- Our forth story took place last week in Luling, Louisiana.
You’ve handled the usual after work rush of customers who stop in on their way home. It is just after 6pm and you’re filling more prescriptions for tomorrow when you hear something unusual from your employee working at the front cash register. A man wearing black clothes, a black mask, and holding a black gun is pushing the cashier towards the pharmacy counter. Put your hands up, the robber says. You do. Give me these drugs. The robber zip-ties the clerk’s hands.
You step back into the stocking shelves and get the drugs. You also grab your gun. You hand the robber the drugs and the robber turns away. You follow a few yards behind him so you can lock the door. That is when the robber turns and charges you. You shoot him once. Now the robber runs away and you get to lock the front door. You untie your employee and call the police.
David- This one sounds like it turned into quite a fight. The defender did the right thing, but sometimes things don’t work out the way we plan.
Rob- What do you mean by that?
David- It looked like it was going bad right from the start, as the robber zip-tied the clerk’s hands. The pharmacist initially tried to comply, but when the robber attempted to tie him as well, he fought. It then appeared that the robber was leaving, but he turned back towards the pharmacist, and the pharmacist fired.
Rob- What would you want your students to do?
David- This is another tough one. Sometime complying with an attacker’s demands can save your life, and sometimes it can get you killed. Of course, anytime someone is threatening you with a gun, your life is at risk…but when they start tying people up, it’s really bad. Whether or not to comply when that starts happening is a personal decision, but personally, I’d rather fight.
Rob- Those strategies aren’t part of a concealed carry course. When would your students learn something like that?
Exit- Rob- that wraps up this episode. David, thank you for helping us again. Where can we learn more about you?
David- My training website is Aegis Solutions on Facebook. I also write about gun rights at BlackManWithAGun.com
Rob- After you look at David’s articles, then leave us a message on the podcast facebook page.
David- We share this podcast with you for free. All we ask is that you share the podcast with a friend and give us a rating on I-Tunes and Stitcher. We’re also available on Google Play Music and Spotify.
Rob- This podcast is part of the Self-defense radio network at sdrn.us
I’m Rob Morse. We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.