Episode 204 with Robyn Sandoval
Rob- Introduction- Welcome to episode 204 of Self-Defense Gun Stories. We’re glad you found us if you’re well trained and also if you’re new to self defense. I’m Rob Morse and we’re joined this week by firearms instructor Robyn Sandoval. Robyn, we’ve heard that gun sales and carry permit applications have increased by a factor of 5 or more. Have you seen that too?
Robyn- Hi, Rob. I’m glad I am able to join you. The past few weeks have been so busy with hundreds of requests for training. It’s so exciting that so many new gun owners are joining our community.
Rob- We received a rating on iTunes this week (171/103). Please go to the iTunes store where you subscribe to podcasts and let new listeners know what you like.
Robyn- We’ll look at recent examples where gun owners were in a life threatening situation. What should we do if we were in their place? We post the links to the original news articles in our show notes.
Our first story took place last week in Cleveland, Ohio.
Rob- First story- Are you armed as you drive home?
It is about six o’clock in the evening when you get home. You see your girlfriend walking her dog across the street. You walk into the home you share when you hear your girlfriend scream. You turn around to see her dog attacking her. You run across the street, but the two of you can’t stop the dog from biting her. You run inside your home, grab your girlfriend’s handgun, and run back outside. You shoot the dog and then try to help your pregnant girlfriend.
She is seriously injured. You call 911. Police arrive as EMTs take your girlfriend to the hospital. She is treated for deep puncture wounds to both hands, both arms, both legs, and to her abdomen. Police see the dead dog and you admit you shot him. Police interview you and your girlfriend. You are not charged.
Robyn- In this case, the defender responded, tried to stop the threat, ran to get a gun, and used it to stop the attack. He stayed at the scene, tried to help his injured girlfriend, and called 911.
Rob- This was a close thing, and seconds count. The dog could have killed her if he bit her neck.
Robyn- The surprising factor is that it was the girlfriend’s own dog. Who would have seen that coming? She might have thought the dog would protect her in an attack, and yet, perhaps she would have wanted to have a concealed carry handgun on her to protect herself from this situation. Ohio has concealed carry, so either of them could have been armed in public.
Rob- I bet that the dog was moving and the girlfriend was moving. How do you shoot a dog and not hurt the person being bitten?
Rob- Most people think they are safer because they have a dog, In the USA, we’re bitten over 4 million times a year. 800 thousand bites require medical treatment, 330 thousand require hospitalization, and 27 thousand require follow on reconstructive surgery.
Robyn- I have a dog, and I have a gun.
Rob- What would you like your students to do if they are outside walking the dog?
Robyn- The same thing I want them to do at any time. Look around, watch for pre-attack indicators from every corner, and be armed so that you can protect yourself.
Rob- You also train for first aid.
Robyn- Yes, Stop the Bleed classes are widely available and are free in most communities. It’s just one or two hours to learn how to stop catastrophic bleeding, which can be the difference in whether or not you go home at the end of the day.
Rob- Medical training isn’t required to carry a gun. Why do you recommend it?
Robyn- Most of my colleagues who have training for decades have never had a situation arise where they had to use their firearm, but they have had to use their medical training. Car accidents, kitchen accidents, even playground accidents happen all the time. Knowing how to stop life-threatening bleeding is so important.
Our second story happened in Oklahoma City.
Rob- Second Story- Are you armed at home?
You hear someone knocking on your door. It is friday morning, the third of july, and you’re not expecting any visitors. About 20 minutes later, you open the door to let your dog out. That is when a stranger breaks your door and pushes his way into your home. You grab your gun and the robber attacks you. You shoot him in the shoulder. He grabs your gun and runs away. You call 911 and ask for police and EMTs. You are pregnant and the EMTs take you to the hospital for a sonogram because your attacker kneed you in the stomach.
Police find your attacker sitting on a curb a hundred yards away. They take your attacker to the hospital and then to jail.
Robyn- The defender had quick access to her firearm.
Robyn- A training class on gun retention may have helped the defender keep possession of her firearm.
Rob- I wonder if the attacker was on drugs.
Robyn- It’s possible since 3 out of 4 assailants are intoxicated at the time of the attack. This person could have wanted to rob her for money or prescriptions.
Rob- What would you like us to do in a situation like this?
Robyn- Again, situational awareness is key. Sometimes people are complacent in their homes, and she was doing a routine of letting her dog out, but keeping her head up and paying attention to her surroundings may have prevented him from gaining access, or her from opening the door in the first place.
Rob- Do you teach your students to defend themselves when the attacker is very close, and the defender can’t extend their arms to shoot?
Robyn- Yes, we offer Close Quarters classes at our National Conference, where students can learn how to defend themselves against a threat that is very close. Being able to draw from the holster and get their muzzle on target immediately is key.
Rob- You don’t need to learn or demonstrate shooting from retention in order to get your carry permit, so would that be called an advanced class?
Robyn- There are some retention techniques that all levels of shooters can use. But, yes, there are advanced CQB classes that can provide even more training on tactics and how to move while shooting.
Our third story happened in Reston, Virginia.
Rob- First this message from DRGO
Rob- Third story- Do you have a gun nearby late at night?
It is almost midnight. Someone is banging loudly on your apartment door. You don’t want to disturb your neighbors, so you go to see who is there. You also grab your firearm before you open the door. You open the door part way to see a stranger standing there. You look down, and see that the stranger is carrying a gun, and his gun is pointed at you. You press the trigger and shoot your attacker in the chest. He moves away and you slam the door closed. You call the police. Police find your attacker and his gun outside your door. They transport him to the hospital where he dies.
You give a brief statement to the police. You’ve never met your attacker before.
Robyn- The defender recognized the threat, responded by using his firearm, called 911.
Robyn- Why did he open the door? Did he not have a peephole? Was there another way to see into the hallway? Could he have yelled through the door to identify who it was?
Rob- Do you talk to your students about opening the door to strangers?
Robyn- Yes, don’t do it! Identify your options, and perhaps find cover and secure your location while you call the police.
Rob- This is another example of shooting from retention, isn’t it.
Rob- Legal insurance if you have to shoot?
Robyn- Our forth story took place in Pasco County, Florida
Rob- Fourth story- Are you armed at home late at night?
You are in your basement playing video games after midnight. You hear the sound of breaking glass and feel your house shake. The sound came from the back of your house where glass doors open to the backyard. You’re armed. You look down the hallway and see three intruders come toward you. They are wearing black clothes. They are masked, and they are armed. So are you. You shoot them as they come down the hallway towards you. The first attacker falls down, then the second, and then you shoot the third attacker. The third attacker is able to run away. You step away from the hallway and call 911.
EMTs declare two of your attackers dead at the scene. Police find your third attacker being held by an armed neighbor who heard the gunshots. The wounded attacker is taken to the hospital, and then to jail.
Your attackers are 19 and 21 years old. They already have arrest records for violent crimes. The police think your attackers saw some of the gun pictures you posted online and came to steal your gun collection. The surviving attacker is charged with murder in the death of his accomplices.
Robyn- The defender identified the threat, was armed, stayed at the scene and didn’t chase the third attacker, and called 911.
Rob- Is it unusual to have more than one attacker?
Robyn- Yes! There are usually two or three working together, so it’s important in training not to get tunnel vision. Be sure to look around. Always assume there is one more nearby.
Rob- If you only read the headline, then you’d ask how a single person stopped three armed attackers who already had guns in their hands. So how did our good guy stop three attackers.
Robyn- The hallway meant that the bad guys were in each other’s way and only one of them could attack at a time.
Also, a neighbor came to help when he heard shots late at night.
Rob- When do your students learn what to say to the police?
Robyn- We encourage students to keep the conversation brief. Tell 911 your location, that you were attacked, that you need police and an ambulance to this location, what you look like or are wearing so that police can identify you, and wait for help to arrive. Point out evidence and describe the attackers, and then wait for your attorney before sharing more information.
Exit- Rob- that wraps up this episode. Robyn, thank you for helping us again. Where can we learn more about you?
Robyn- Look for me at https://www.agirlandagun.org/ and A Girl & A Gun on all of the social media pages. We have events coming up soon.
Rob- After you look at Robyn articles, then leave us a message on the podcast facebook page.
Robyn- We share this podcast with you for free.
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Rob- This show is part of the Self-defense radio network. Find more pro-freedom podcasts at sdrn.us
I’m Rob Morse. We’ll be back next week with more Self-Defense Gun Stories.